Paven Kaur
Forum Replies Created
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Sorry just one more – I did actually cap the first nap today. I left the wake windows as is – is that ok or would I shorten the first wake window by 15 minutes? I let him sleep 45 minutes from the moment he fell asleep as took him 10 minutes to fall asleep but do you wake them up 45 minutes from the moment you lay them down?
Best wishes,
Pav
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Hi Emma,
Thank you for your reply. I really appreciate your response. I do think he is ready for one nap as two naps is only seems to be working as we wake him up all the time and he is still energetic in the day. I previously tried waiting until he showed tired cues and got to 4 hours and he still didn’t show any, he just kept playing. The other day I let him sleep in for his first nap for an hour and a half as I needed him to take his second nap in the car and he although he was yawning and rubbing eyes etc, he fought the nap and didn’t sleep – although this may be because he isn’t a good car sleeper but that was the first time he just refused to sleep in the car. He was then awake for 7.5 hours then cried for 30 minutes at bedtime unfortunately. If I transition to one nap, I would prefer to do it gradually, how would I know when to offer a second and can I do a carrier nap or best in the crib? I would let him sleep til 7am if we moved to 1 nap as per his preferred wake up time.
Best wishes,
Paven Kaur
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Hi Emma,
I was hoping to pick your brain. I have discovered Rohan’s sleepy cues show around 3 hours then first nap then about 3.25-3.5 then second nap then 3.5 then bedtime. He falls asleep quickly. He was doing mostly well on this but then I thought I would try to distribute the naps so the afternoon nap would is longer. The first day he did well after I woke him after 45 minutes from the first nap with a 1 hr 40 minute nap (although he had been swimming), second day he took a 1 hour second nap and today the second nap is 29 minutes – does this mean this rhythm does not suit him or should I try a bit longer or try waking after an hour from the first nap or bring the second nap earlier? I wonder if this rhythm could be making him overtired hence not taking the second nap and today he cried when he woke up for a few minutes. He is sleeping well overnight for now.
Best wishes, Pav
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Sorry to send another message but I thought this update may be useful. Today I went off Rohan’s sleepy cues. As soon as he showed them I put him to bed. First wake window was 2 hours 50, took him 7 minutes and he slept for 1 hour 15. Second one was 3 hrs 30 with eye rubbing and yawning when I put him down. Prior to that he has been swimming and was rolling around trying to crawl (can get on all fours and rock but not moving yet despite really wanting to) so he should have been exhausted. Took him 15 minutes to fall asleep then he slept for 35 minutes and was awake. I waited 15 minutes then he started to whimper so I picked him up. He then stayed awake 3 hours 30 with no sleepy cues. Still rolling around when I put him to bed and took him 25 minutes to fall asleep. The only other time this has happened was with prior to a nap tranistion but I think he is way too young for one nap. I think he is either going through a regression or needs longer wake windows. My plan was to go with his flow as he is happy – what do you think? Maybe over time the naps will swap around?
Best wishes, Pav
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Sorry to send a second message but I realised I didn’t explain my concern well – I am concerned that a wake window > 3 hours 15 would be too big for his age? And I am not sure whether he would do better off a by the clock schedule although we have not done this before? Best wishes, Pav
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Hi Emma,
Thank you for your reply. When I messaged initially Rohan was taking a long time to fall asleep but still taking a long nap. Now he is taking a long time for fall asleep~15 minutes before nap 2 and 20-25 minutes before bedtime but now he is taking a short 30 minute nap for nap 2 and waking earlier in the morning i.e. 6am instead of his usual 7am. I have tried both 3 hours and 3 hours 15 before nap 2 – he does not seem that tired when I put him down and just babbled until he sleeps. He is waking up after 30 minutes then playing until I pick him up. He is happy then stays awake for 3.5 hours until bed then takes 20-25 minutes to fall asleep for bed, where is again just babbling and hanging out. Could it be that he is under tired and I need bigger wake windows with his increasing age? Do wake windows change significantly like this during this phase?
Best wishes, Pav
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I should also mention that majority of the time, Rohan does then take a nap > 1 hour. This afternoon he took 15 minutes to fall asleep but then I woke him up as it had been 2 hours so I am not sure if this is just a phase or normal for his age. Best wishes, Pav
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Hi Emma
I hope you are keeping well. We have been doing well with the 2.5/3/3.5 schedule until recently when it has started taking Rohan longer to fall asleep. He will be 10 months old in 8 days time. He used to take 5 minutes to fall asleep for naps very consistently but this time is getting longer. Initially 10 minutes and today 15 minutes. Occasionally it has taken him longer than 20 minutes to fall asleep for bedtime which is very unusual. He isn’t upset but just babbling in bed until he decides to sleep. I am thinking of extending his wake windows to put him down when he seems sleepy rather than the schedule time as he seems to want to stay awake longer. My gut feeling is it will probably work out as something like 2 hrs 45/3 hrs 15/3 hrs 30. Is it best to implement a schedule at this age or ok to balance time with sleepy cues which is what I would like to do as I imagine each month he will want to stay awake longer until he drops to one nap. I would appreciate your thoughts. Best wishes, Pav
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Hi Emma,
- Thank you so much for your reply. Sorry for my delay replying. I have been testing out if I could have Rohan’s wake windows wrong. I usually take him for a walk towards the end of a wake window but I think this was giving him a second wind as now I have moved the walk to earlier, he is grumpy earlier so I have been putting him down at around 2.5/3/3.5 instead – with this, he has taken the second nap for over an hour for 3 days in a row. I will keep trying this and hopefully it sticks. He did wake overnight last night at around 3am for about 40 minutes babbling and trying to roll in his sleep sack – I assume to practice rolling. I left him to it as he was happy. He then slept til 7 when I woke him up. I am trying to let him practice in the day as much as possible but the 4-5 hours he is doing is apparently not enough! : D Thank you for your encouraging message as I was worried if he would have difficulty transitioning to one nap. He has never been a baby to do a 2 hour nap in the afternoon. He has usually done 1.25-1.5 hour naps for the first and second. I did decide to wake him from his first nap if he is still asleep at 11am as it disrupts his meal schedule otherwise (he doesn’t mind when I wake him at this stage as it has been an hour and a half) and if he wakes a little before 7, I have been leaving him to babble as long as he is happy and it isn’t a long time eg >20 minutes. If he continues to wake regularly before 7 then maybe I will stretch wake windows slowly? Bedtime has been variable depending on his naps between 630 and 730pm. I do prefer to go with his natural rhythm as he is such a happy bub. Fingers crossed that this may work for him. Many thanks, Pav
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Hi Emma,
I hope you are keeping well. I was hoping to ask for your help with Rohan’s 2 nap schedule. He is due to turn 9 months in one week. We have been transitioning from 3 to 2 naps for the last 4.5 weeks. I initially started with gradually increasing wake windows to 2.5/3/3-3.5 to get to a 6pm bedtime. During that time he needed a 6pm bedtime (lasted approximately 3 weeks), Rohan was waking early at around 5-5.45am but just babbling in bed, very happy to wait to be picked up at 6am.and taking two long naps of 1.25-1.5 hours each with over 11.5 hours of night sleep. On 3 naps, he would nap for about 3 hours total with 11 hours night sleep. I thought he was undertired as he was very happy when waking up so I extended the wake windows to 2.45-3/3.5/3.5 and he is now sleeping 7pm to 7am (for the last 8 days) but only taking one long nap in the morning of 1-1.5 hours with a very short second nap of 25-45 minutes. I always leave him 20 minutes from waking from his nap to see if he can reconnect. I have tried to hold him during the second nap but he won’t go back to sleep. I tried the second nap in the carrier with a pacifier but he still was wide awake after 45 minutes and very happy. He can then stay awake 3.5 hours no problems. He only gets tired after his bath which is about 15 minutes before bedtime. I tried capping the first nap to one hour for two days but it only worked on the first day as I thought the problem was distribution of sleep as he is getting enough sleep (12 hours night and ~2 hours nap). I tried waiting for his sleepy cues instead of a schedule but he is fine then gets grumpy suddenly and wants to be asleep, there is no eye rubbing or yawning etc. We previously worked off a set schedule on 3 naps which worked really well. In the last week we have moved across the country, he has multiple teeth coming in and he is trying to crawl. I am abit stumped as to what to do or whether to just accept this sleep pattern which is fine too as he is sleeping fine overnight. Any thoughts would be appreciated on the optimal schedule for his age group or if there is something I am doing wrong here – maybe too much awake time or too little or maybe normal at this stage with the crawling etc or will it change over time naturally for a longer second nap?
Best wishes
Pav
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Hi Emma,
Thank you for your reply. I have moved him back to 3 naps as I felt he was too tired by day 5. I will see where he is at in a few weeks then reassess. Thank you for your advice!
Best wishes,
Pav
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Hi Emma,
Thanks for your reply.
I thought Rohan was ready as his morning wake window is 2 hr 15 and then 2 hr 40 then 2 hr 45 then I keep the one before bed at 2 hr 45 just to keep bedtime at 8pm but he has done 3 hours before and sometimes bedtime is 815pm-ish. I am having to cap the morning nap and second nap to 1 hour and 1 hour 15 to fit everything into the day. The last nap of the day is 15-25 minutes – again to fit in. He stays awake 2 hr 45 if the nap is less than 30 minutes which it mostly is now but 3 hours if 30 minutes. Initially on 3 naps, we were waking up at 7am, having two 1.5 hour naps then a 30 minutes carrier nap and still getting to bed before 8pm but now it has become fiddly. There were a couple of days where Rohan didn’t take a long second nap after 2 hrs 30 wake window.
Rohan is mostly waking at 7am, occasionally after 620. He has not woken before 6am.
I tried Rohan on 2 naps and he seemed fine at first but by day 5, he slept 12.5 hours at night then was knackered after being awake for 1 hr 45 so I went back to 3 naps from there.
2 hours in the morning would be a bit short for Rohan. He doesn’t look tired then.
So I feel a bit stuck. It is all fiddly but then 2 naps seemed too hard for him. He did sleep at night every night for 12 hours except that one 5 minute babble but naps weren’t as smooth plus by day 3 he was crying on going down and during the transition for naps, which he does not usually do. He usually doesn’t cry at all on going to sleep, just fusses.
He is 6.5 months and I was thinking of seeing where things are at 7 months? I also wonder if 2.5/3/3 would have worked better as the last 30 minutes of the last wake window was a clear struggle for him.
Your thoughts would be appreciated.
Best wishes,
Pav
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Hi Emma,
I just wanted to give you an update. On day 5, Rohan seemed very tired despite sleeping for 12 hours overnight. I did hear him wake him around 430am babbling to himself for about 5 minutes then he went back to sleep. He woke up happy but then crashed quickly about 1 hr 50 minutes later crying alot so I put him down and he fell asleep. I woke him up after an 1 hr 30 to go to a class. Then he was awake for 2 hr 50 minutes, got a bit fussy so put down for nap 2 and I woke him up after an hour to fit a third nap in. He fell asleep in the pram at 2 hours 25ish – he very rarely sleeps in the pram as he is normally so excited to look around. He slept for 25 minutes. I then put him down to sleep for the night at 8pm after 2 hrs 45 awake. It was all a bit messy but I just went with his sleepy cues.
I will see what tomorrow brings but I think maybe he isn’t ready just yet or is it common to go between 2 and 3 naps like this?
Does the babbling at 430am count as an early morning wake?
What should the maximum wake windows be before going to 2 naps as maybe I should spend more time with Rohan on those and maybe a micronap before bed like 10-15 minutes?
Any advice would be appreciated to make the transition smooth and to avoid over tiredness.
Best wishes,
Pav
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Hi Emma, how are you? I hope you have been keeping well. Here I am again but this time with the two nap transition! I tried to hold on to three naps as long as possible but Rohan started having short naps and waking up slightly earlier in the mornings. I am on day 4 and it looks like this so far.
Wake around 645-7am
First nap 2.5 hours later and sleeps around 90 minutes
Wake up around 11am
Second nap 3 hours later
3.5 hour wake window then bed around 7pm
I have a few questions I am hoping you can help with:
1. What do I do if Rohan sleeps 11 hours instead of 12 at night as this is what he has usually done?
2. On day 3 and 4 he seemed to find it harder to connect cycles during nap 2. In fact on day 3 he didn’t, when he has previously successfully linked for weeks. Does this happen during nap transitions? I recall the same happened when going from 4 to 3 naps for about 2 weeks then it clicked. When this happens I have been going for an early bedtime but perhaps a third cat nap would be better? Day 4 he did connect cycles but it wasn’t as smooth as previous.
3. You previously mentioned you can cap the first nap to distribute sleep to the second. I don’t plan to do that at the moment but if I did in the future, what age is that appropriate from?
4. Do you think the above schedule looks ok as he is actually getting more sleep on this schedule than on 3 naps where he had 11 hours night sleep and 3.5 hours day sleep?
5. When do you increase the last wake window to 4 hours?
Best wishes,
Pav
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Hi Emma, thank you very much for your reply.
He is a little upset (just whimpering) when I wake him from the 3rd nap but this lasts less than a minute and he is then fine until bedtime. I think for now I will carry on capping. I have been trying to make sure he gets at least 3 hours of day time sleep in. I keep thinking if he wakes before 730 then I will start the day earlier but he falls back asleep majority of the time eg today he woke at 7am and was babbling, by the time I got to his room, he was asleep again so I left him then woke him up at 730. I don’t think he is ready for 2 naps yet but I do not think he will be on 3 naps for long.
Currently his routine is:
Wake 730am
First nap 930am – I tend to wake him if he hasn’t woken after 1.5 hours around 11am.
Wake window around 2 hours 15 then second nap – if he hasn’t woken himself then I will wake him up around 1445. He doesn’t always have a long second nap but it is becoming more often than not.
Wake window 2 hours 15 – 2 hours 30 then third nap in carrier – I wake him by 1720.
Last wake window 2 hours 30-40 then bedtime around 1950.
It seems to be working ok for now but I will keep an eye..
Best wishes,
Pav